[TrevC]

One of the Orange stripe cardinals has started to die. Should I cull it or leave it?

[tommo]

i would recommend removing it at least!

Looks like a nasty bacterial infection!

Tom

[dylan]

yep get that one outta there

[tommo]

chances of recovery without atibiotics are slim, id just cull it TBF m8

[jason@jasonsaquatics]

Me and tony aka Karnivor were chatting about this the other day in the fact that cardinals see to suffer this ,as like the freshwater cardinals and the neon's seem to suffer this very same infection

I would cull it Trev


jas

[dylan]

good point jas i hadn't thought of that but your spot on we've tried treatment on both freshwater fish but i feel it's incurrable as the fish dont seem to last long enough for any treatment to take affect

[tommo]

The biggest difference here is that this problem is bacterial, the freshwater neon disease (which ive been very lucky with cardinals with) is parasitic and can be stopped from spreading by culling clearly affected individuals and treating with octozin

Ive treated this very disease successfully in chromis, cardinals and dottybacks using oxytetracycline and nitrofurazone (seperate incidents), theres virtually no chance of obtaining the latter legally in the UK but oxytet should be available through a vet. Its probably not worth it for one fish however. By the symptoms, I would imagine it is a Pseudomonas sp bacteria that produces this infection, though i havent ever had one swabbed so i cant say for sure. Luyckily oxytet is a broad spectrum effective (in marine fish) gram negative antibiotic so it covers alot of bacteria species.

HTH

Tom

[jason@jasonsaquatics]

Tommo,I can see what mark ment when he put me in contact with you ,your info is of great help to us m8 nice one

Jas

[TrevC]

Tommo, jas thanks for all the help.

Removed the fish and sent him to fish heaven.

I've lost another one.........not sure how or why as I have found no remains???

[jason@jasonsaquatics]

Is there any foul play going on Trev


jas

[karnivor]

As said above, I have also suffered the same problem with my red spot cardinals. I tried treating with Erythromyicin (also gram -ve ) broad spectrum antibiotic, but couldnt save them. Possibly a higher dose was needed or the infection was too far gone but its worth mentioning.

It would be ideal if it was effective as I already use it to control Cyano, so keep it in stock.

I also suffered some early losses with my threadfin cardinals a while back but those that have remained have done really well and are even mouth brooding. I can only assume that they dont like disturbance or shipping.

[mrfishy]

hi trev hope your losses have come to an end, must be gutting to watch.
just wondering how this can be so indiscriminate, tony had 10 red spot cardinals from taunton i had 8 all out of a shoal of maybe 100. tony was down to 6 last time we spoke all mine are still alive and well ?, can't be tank conditions as tony's tank is stunningly healthy as you will know if youve been to the prof's HQ.
cheers
drew

[lindsay]

Is it possible that in a group the weaker ones are picked on by the others in the group and go downhill .

[karnivor]

lindsay, on Sep 1 2009, 09:31 AM, said:

Is it possible that in a group the weaker ones are picked on by the others in the group and go downhill .

Its certainly a puzzler. I thought of 3 possibilities.

Only 1 fish was originally infected, and passed it on to the others in the transport bag.
My tank was carrying the infection and introducing stressed fish caused them to become infected.
My tank parameters were less favourable to this fish than Drews.

One thing is for sure, it seems to be a problem with certain Cardinals. If I buy any more I will try and pretreat them with antibiotics.

As far as treatment is concerned, I wonder if its already too late by the time you can see white flesh. I suspect the white flesh is already dead and cant recover.

[lindsay]

The next lot we get in ile keep for a few weeks and feed them vitamin enriched food 5 to 6 times a day.If i spot any of them being picked on by the others ile take that fish out put him in another tank and after a week or so put in with the group again.

[TrevC]

5 remaining fish all quite healthy and no more issues.

When the fish was dieing, all the other fish stayed well away from it.
The healthy fish did not pick on it.

[lindsay]

Glad to hear the rest are doing ok m8.

[jason@jasonsaquatics]

glad all is ok Trev ,will see you when your in next m8


jas

[BOM8ER]

Great news mate

[dave14]

good to hear Trev